Henrique Machado on TVI

Post updated on June 06, 13:00 with the transcription of the interview on June 04 2007, 13:00 News.
Post updated on June 06, 16:30 with the transcription of the interview on June 04 2007, 20:00 News.

All TV stations in Portugal, opened their eight o'clock news with the “new” German suspect. Of the various channels we would like to highlight TVI, as it had as a guest Henrique Machado.

Henrique Machado, we remind readers, was a witness for the McCanns in the McCann v Amaral damages trial:

http://mccannvamarallibeltrial.blogspot.com/2013/10/henrique-machado.html

HENRIQUE MACHADO ON TVI - JUNE 03 2007, 20:00 News

José Alberto Carvalho: We have on the eight o'clock news the TVI justice editor Henrique Machado, good evening Henrique

Henrique Machado: Good evening

JAC: However surprising it may be, and it is, and we gave the breaking news on TVI24, about half an hour ago...it is… it is information that must be taken with all the seriousness and solidity possible, because otherwise, no...three police from three different countries would not involve their reputation in an investigation as sensitive as this one has always been from the beginning…

HM: Yes, naturally, from the point of view of taking official assumption of the formal suspicions that befall this man.

JAC: Is this man a formal suspect right now?

HM: He's a formal suspect. This man...I believe that with...

JAC: And he’s the first?

HM: And it's the first, he’s the first. And this is what gives credibility to this news piece because people already have a tendency to look at this case with all the developments that have happened in the Maddie case over the last 10 years, I will not say 13 but 10, this has all been highly speculative and people think it’s more of the same, only the suspect changes, and… and… and… and… and is launched the discredit on the criminal investigation, first in Portugal, then in England where the Metropolitan Police has spent loads, millions pounds to...for the investigation of this case and it was never successful. In this case, 13 years later, the PJ, which was the...the...the main impulse and is the main responsible for the results of this investigation, has formally assumed in a written statement the suspicions about this man. I remind you that at the time, as early as two thousand...in that hot month of May 2007 when this child disappeared, the case evolved very quickly and in completely opposite directions, suspicions about a gentleman who was a neighbour of the couple...of the couple, so, of the Ocean Club, of the resort venture where the couple was on vacation, which was Robert Murat, then there was a Russian citizen who also became a suspect and then the McCann couple, the parents of this child, were even made arguidos and there a  great tension because there were formal suspicions that they were responsible, or suspects of...of...for the disappearance of the child, but the PJ never crossed, in quotation marks, the...with...with...the assumption of these suspicions. Regarding this suspect, they do. And I would like to say that this suspect, with the evidence that exists at this moment in the process, is not only arrested, in the context of issuing a European Arrest Warrant, for example, since he is in the European space because the man is already in prison, right? The gentleman is already imprisoned in the context of a process also of a sexual nature, and this refers us to the motivation, to the motive of this crime that has to do with the… with the fact that… of… of… this gentleman has motivations of a sexual nature, as I said.

JAC: Two or three questions about this, Henrique. First, there is no information on whether this suspect has already been formally questioned by the police...

HM: He was, He was questioned...

JAC: Was he?

HM: He was questioned and does not confess to the crime.

JAC: And...and did answer the questions or remit to silence, is it known?

HM: I know he didn't collaborate, he didn't collaborate with justice...

JAC: With the authorities...and was this interrogation done by the German authorities?

HM: Naturally it has to be, the jurisdiction is German.

JAC: Naturally. Uh… uh… it is unknown what fate would have been given to the child who would be seventeen today.

HM: The conviction is that we are facing...

JAC: Murder...

HM:…abduction and homicide crimes, and that this abduction was motivated by crimes of a sexual nature.

JAC: All these developments, in short, have been gathered in the last few hours, and it has here this corollary that will demand a greater attention, naturally in the next few hours...

HM: Now, José Alberto, the million-dollar question is what evidence does the investigation have for this man. Because it is not enough to have reason and opportunity...

JAC: I was going to ask you, because I know you were reading, I didn't have that opportunity, a statement from the PJ, which is just out, what is it in your opinion is worth emphasizing...

HM: It is worth emphasizing that, and this is relevant information in relation to what we already have, in addition to the assumption of the suspicions, they refer that he is a German citizen who was not passing through Portugal, therefore was not a tourist. He has lived in Portugal since 95 or 96 and therefore only left Portugal curiously or not, in 2007, so 10, 12, 11 or 12 years after arriving in our country...

JAC: Which immediately raises a series of other questions, if he was 30 at the time of Maddie's disappearance...

HM: He is 43 now.

JAC: …yes, he would have lived in Portugal since he was very young, probably 17, 18… uh .. and… and there in… Praia da Luz… anyway. We have a formal suspect...

HM: We have a formal suspect...

JAC: …it is not known what substantive evidence exists?

HM:…not just for having… not just for having reason and opportunity that he was actually there, and reason because we already realized that someone with a… sexual compulsion… he’s in jail for… for crimes of the same nature committed on another victim, but this is not enough. The PJ besides this also has evidence, namely the collection of metadata. What is metadata? It is the cellular information that our cell phone leaves on the antennas of the place where we are, and this was collected as soon...

JAC: Even 13 years later?

HM: No. It was collected in May 2007.

JAC: Ah.

HM: Therefore, the PJ and the Portimão’s Public Ministry retained this information immediately from the operators at the time before they disappeared...

JAC: But they didn’t come up with this name, this suspect, nor the chance of being someone with these...

HM: No, no...Hundreds or thousands of people were investigated. It is not easy to routinize all foreigners who pass through Lagos...

JAC: Certainly...

HM:...in the summer months or almost in the summer, we are talking about...

JAC: Yes, Henrique, what is also unknown, to conclude, what was the initial clue that pointed the investigators in this direction?

HM: No. I at least am not in possession of that information, but I have no doubt that the PJ have it. Th PJ have it and the German police have it, being the two main players involved in this. The Metropolitan Police also enters, naturally it had an international investigation, but it is mainly the PJ…

JAC: Yes, because it was favourable, sorry to interrupt, it was fa...it was, it was good that the English police did not torpedo and therefore be in agreement, errm...and were properly informed about the steps of this investigation...

HM: Yes, of course, not least because they have a lot of information collected from the...of the last years with all the investment they have made and that they were in Portugal, etcetera. And, and therefore… and diplomatic relations also count a lot here…

JAC: A lot…

HM:…that things went a little sour in 2007 when it was realised that there was a formal suspicion about the couple. I wouldn’t like to go away without saying about that formal suspicion about the couple, that in relation to the couple our investigation and the process, as far as they are concerned, went from 80 to, I won’t say 8, but it went to zero. This couple has no evidence that it was minimally involved in the disappearance…

JAC: Maddie's parents?

HM: Maddie's parents...

JAC: But there was only...

HM: …in Maddie's disappearance, but there is a crime that they committed…

JAC: Of negligence...

HM: It is a crime of...

JAC: Abandonment...

HM: …it is a crime of exposure or abandonment of this child, and our Public Ministry never had the courage to hold responsible the gentlemen for this crime. And there, I think it was done more politics than justice if, if you allow me.

JAC: Very well, we will follow the developments and try to understand them better, because this is in fact, in short, in the middle of a pandemic, in the midst of an international crisis, it is one of the most unlikely news items that we could give, thank you Henrique for coming to the 8 o’clock news.

HM: Thank you.


Readers can compare what was said by Henrique Machado on TVI and the PJ’s written statement:

“Investigation into the disappearance of an English child in the Algarve in 2007

Published on 03/06/2020

The PJ confirms that, as part of the investigation into the disappearance of an English child, which took place in the Algarve in 2007, diligences are being developed, for the full clarification of the situation.

In close coordination with the German (BKA) and English (Metropolitan Police) authorities, in sharing information, carrying out formal investigative and expert acts, in Portugal and abroad, elements were collected that indicate the possible intervention, in the disappearance of the child, from a German citizen.

The suspect in question, 43, with a criminal record, resided in Portugal between 1996 and 2007 and is currently serving a prison sentence in Germany.

The family of the missing child was informed of these investigative developments by the English authorities.

The investigation continues.”

One thing that really stands out is that nowhere in this statemnet is “McCann”, “Madeleine” or “Maddie” used, which would be the most naturally used words to search for the subject.

*****

HENRIQUE MACHADO ON TVI - JUNE 04 2007, 13:00 News

João Póvoa Marinheiro: And for the analysis of these latest developments, I have TVI's justice editor, Henrique Machado. Henrique, good afternoon…

Henrique Machado: Hello, good afternoon.

JPM: ... what is the probability of an outcome after so many years?

HM: It is remote. It is remote. Even, even by virtue of, of… the more than likely prescription of this case. I mean, the crime of kidnapping is already prescribed, the crime of homicide prescribes in 15 years and it’s been already 13, so if there is no suspension of the prescription period, and I think there is not, this case had to be resolved with condemnation in court in the next until the prescription, and therefore only by magic arts would the Public Ministry achieve this. Even so because one can understand that this case is far from being concluded from the point of view of the investigation...

JPM: And are these investigation clues the most consistent?

HM: We do not know the clues, we do not know the clues, we know what are circumstances that this suspect actually fits in the profile that is sought by the police, that is, he had a motive and had opportunity. Motive, because he is a person with connections to violent crimes, of a sexual nature or of theft, possibly a theft that could have gone wrong, a burglary there on the Ocean Club resort where the child was sleeping could have gone wrong, and then he took the victim for some reason, and had the opportunity because he was effectively there, in that area, at that time. And there is also the circumstance, curious or not, that this gentleman living in Portugal since 95 or 96 and disappears from the Algarve right after the crime in 2007.

JPM: And precisely in relation to that fact, in relation to these latest developments, this is yet another blow to the investigation that was done here, to the… disappearance, yet another blow in PJ's reputation…

HM: No!!...

JPM: …taking into account that the suspect lived all this time in the Algarve.

HM: ...I think not even because the police ...

JPM: …despite…

HM: The PJ is part of the solution of this investigation and in this outcome of outcome, that is, in this direction that we now know, and it is not part of the problem. In other words, the PJ was one of the main impulses for the investigation to now move in this direction in articulation with the German and English authorities. Why? Because it is the PJ that has the work namely the collection of cellular information in relation to cell phones that triggered antennas in Praia da Luz at that time. That is why, the police now have reference to those 2 phone numbers that… they appeal to whoever used those numbers and who have contacted the suspect, etcetera, so that they contact the police and make statements that can be useful to the clarification of the truth. And so there is an enormous amount of work done here by the PJ, which then naturally needs to be complemented. But I already said it here yesterday and I say it again, I mean, there are no miracles because, I think we are talking about the Algarve, not in the peak of summer but in May already when there is a lot of traffic to… a… especially associated with tourism of people who pass through the Algarve and then go to the most different corners of the world. Therefore, routinizing 600 or 700 people who minimally fit a certain profile, who left Portugal, whose cell phones activated those antennas, this is not easy ...

JPM: And 13 years ago ...

HM: … for years a series of people were screened, it ended up to this suspect, and what we know is not evidence, as I said, they are clues in some way, but are not enough to assume a formal suspicion. If the police, namely the PJ, for the first time in this case, formally assume, even in a statement, formal suspicions in relation to this man, surely they have matter of proof that we do not know beyond this, which is mere circumstantial questions. And we realize that on the one hand they have evidence, but that evidence is still not enough for an accusation, because we see the German and English police, the German and English police asking for collaboration for people who have seen that van, that car, that have seen the… who have contacted this man through those cell phone numbers, etcetera. Therefore, there are loose ends, and the… it would be very difficult to reach this child's body, if indeed…

JPM: We are at ...

HM: …the homicide thesis, but to understand where those vehicles were, I think the purpose of that is to try to find out where the body may have been hidden by this suspect.

JPM: Henrique, thank you for analysing these latest developments.


We are certain that when Henrique Machado speaks of this being the first time there is a formal suspect, he certainly means post-archival.

The be given the status of arguido is to be made a formal suspect, and the case has had 3 of them: Robert Murat, Kate and Gerry McCann.

Also, since he is the justice editor of a main TV station in Portugal, as far as we know, this German man has not been given the arguido status and until then he cannot be considered to be a formal suspect in any way.

*****

HENRIQUE MACHADO ON TVI - JUNE 04 2007, 20:00 News

Pedro Pinto: Henrique Machado, TVI's justice editor. Henrique, good night, does it seem like a sufficiently sustained thesis, in short, that leads to this German suspect or are we facing a handful of nothing?

Henrique Machado: Based on the public knowledge that we have in the case, the case so far it is a handful of nothing in the sense that we do not know what are the strong clues that lead to… that 3 reputable police forces that is, like the PJ, the German police and the Metropolitan police in London, that is to say ... what is it that leads them to formally assume suspicions on this man, we do not know what exists from the point of view of matter of proof, what we know are clues, are ... are ... are merely circumstantial proof of someone who in fact could have a motive and opportunity to commit this crime, or an opportunity because he was and lived there, the motives because it has already been realized that this man has a profile that links to a violent crime, of a sexual nature or even… of robberies and also related to drug trafficking in the Algarve area during the years he lived there, but none of this, very really, is sufficient, strategically it was not in any of the 3 countries disclosed for now any question related to the evidence, that is, we do not know the evidence they have…

PP: The clues are, are clear to identify, the fact that he was close to the village of Luz, the fact that he (imperceptible) with the car the next day and the fact that he made a call that night, are worth what they are worth…

HM: But this is worth what it is, I mean, because there are, there are 400 or 500 people passing by during those days, they also use the same antennas for phone calls that they make, they are in circulation to their countries of origin since that is a zone markedly… it is a zone very much marked by, by tourism and therefore, I mean, none of this is enough, now…

PP: It means that the leads are also somehow launching this lead and waiting for, perhaps, locals who at the time ...

HM: I have no doubt that the objective...

PP: …have been aware, have had contact with...

HM: Right.

PP: …with this suspect can add more to this investigation…

HM: Right. We know the profile of the PJ, and it accustomed us over the past few years and we know that the PJ is not in the habit of making public announcements of investigations when they are halfway through. They usually prefer to communicate either when there are arrests or when an investigation ends well, that is, with a proposal of indictment against someone. In this case, I dare say that the PJ was a little bit towed by what is the communication policy of, of, of the police ... especially the police...

PP: Towed or also against their will?

HM: Maybe also a little against their will, as maybe a little against their will, but I think the pressure to divulge this, these advances in the investigation, of having a formal suspect, starts from the English, but this naturally they want to show service because this, this investigation done in England has been sustained with many millions of pounds over the years, this on the one hand...

PP: But in this case, in the case of the Portuguese police, in short, there is not exactly a deep conviction that this individual...

HM: Nooo… no, there is! There is that deep conviction on the part of the Portuguese police, what would not have existed was the desire to communicate it yesterday to the country as they had to do towed by, by, by ... by the other 2 police. But this has a purpose that I accept and understand, which is to try in some way to make people who have knowledge about what happened that night, people related to this, this man… that relates to them directly or indirectly, that they may now come to provide new… statements to, to the process and that namely clarify questions related to a cell phone, two cell phone numbers that have already been disclosed by the police and also in relation to the location of that van that the suspect used. So, this we have understood...

PP: And which deep down sustains these suspicions ...

HM: …we on understanding that this is important for the investigation, we also get to know that the investigation is far from being, of being with… of being concluded because they still need to tie several, several ends, but effectively there is something that we do not know, or from a scientific point of view, scientific, expert evidence. Let us suppose, and now we enter in the field of speculation, that there is a trace of DNA from, from Maddie that is found in either one of these vehicles or in one of the houses that this suspect frequented at that time, or else let's suppose a piece of clothing. This is expert evidence and these leave no room for, room for doubt. Another type of evidence is the testimonial evidence of someone who came to the process, pointing out the name of that gentleman, and who has demonstrated by A plus B why he was the one to commit the crime but in relation to that ...

PP: Right, this is a process that is going to take a long time, it will (imperceptible) still until we reach a definite conclusion. Henrique Machado, thank you for the clarifications that you brought here.

HM: I thank you.

*****

In 24 hours, it went from something that had to be taken seriously as 3 police forces had put their entire reputations at stake, to a handful of nothing...