by Volunteer Contributor Quite Intrigued.
I find the profile of the 'guests' of the Ocean Club very strange.
If they were 'so into each other' as Clarence Mitchell stated why the T9 didn’t group just rent a private villa?
That way they could have kept their private affairs private, if they were swingers.
It would have been far cheaper in total, for the 9, as a villa can be rented for less than £3000 and has maid service that would also babysit in the evenings.
This is from my experience of my visits to PdL when I stayed in a villa, and this was a LONG time ago when that particular villa was new.
The other people staying there at the same time are not the sort of people I, or anybody, would have thought would stay at a place like the OC as it looks like a very basic place.
The other thing I find very odd is Gerry McCann playing tennis when golf is his thing, surely going to the Algarve and not playing golf is bizarre?
Even a 'pilgrimage' to Vilamoura isn't something that any keen golfer would do? The numerous Algarve Golf Clubs, as far as I know, are prepared to rent golf clubs for very reasonable prices as it’s of their own interest to attract all possible golfers that, as on holiday, have much else to pack besides this.
This “lack” of golfing makes me think there was surely a reason they HAD to stay on site at the OC.
I haven't seen anyone else mention the golf thing apart from GM being a golfer.
I don't know why this case is so important to me, maybe it's because I hate injustice and have experienced the British legal system, which stinks at times."
I find the profile of the 'guests' of the Ocean Club very strange.
If they were 'so into each other' as Clarence Mitchell stated why the T9 didn’t group just rent a private villa?
That way they could have kept their private affairs private, if they were swingers.
It would have been far cheaper in total, for the 9, as a villa can be rented for less than £3000 and has maid service that would also babysit in the evenings.
This is from my experience of my visits to PdL when I stayed in a villa, and this was a LONG time ago when that particular villa was new.
The other people staying there at the same time are not the sort of people I, or anybody, would have thought would stay at a place like the OC as it looks like a very basic place.
The other thing I find very odd is Gerry McCann playing tennis when golf is his thing, surely going to the Algarve and not playing golf is bizarre?
Even a 'pilgrimage' to Vilamoura isn't something that any keen golfer would do? The numerous Algarve Golf Clubs, as far as I know, are prepared to rent golf clubs for very reasonable prices as it’s of their own interest to attract all possible golfers that, as on holiday, have much else to pack besides this.
This “lack” of golfing makes me think there was surely a reason they HAD to stay on site at the OC.
I haven't seen anyone else mention the golf thing apart from GM being a golfer.
I don't know why this case is so important to me, maybe it's because I hate injustice and have experienced the British legal system, which stinks at times."
Agree with you QI. I also find it strange how such a basic place as you say would offer so many side services (two restaurants and day & night nannies). I think Text has a valid point, it wasn't the facilities or the location that determined the choice of PdL for that holiday. let's see wht Textsa has up the sleeve
ReplyDeleteNem mais! Isso mesmo!
ReplyDeleteSempre achei também muito estranho que aqueles fossem numa época baixa, mais barata e para o OC tão old, estores com mais de 14 anos como diz uma empregada do dito. Ou ex-empregada, agora?
Sim, sim.Alguma razão seria para ficarem ali. O sitío de todas as combinações para desconhecidos?
deixarem as Crianças sózinhas à noite sem qualquer protecção? Ali, à disposição de...............
http://madelmccann.blogspot.com/
ReplyDeletehttp://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/11/19/48hours/main3520936.shtml
http://frommybigdesk.blogspot.com/2010/01/madeleine-mccann-jane-tanner-never-left.html
http://www.nationalinvestigation.com/news.html
Li hoje essa declaração da empregada.
Também poderá estar n mcannfiles.
Foi quando andei à procura de Mrs. Fenn Pamela .
ReplyDeleteMas como uso browsers diferentes......agora é-me difícil para já, saber onde foi.
Not getting this. Are they swingers or not? If they were they would go to a Villa, right?
ReplyDeleteIf swinging wasn't the reason for them to go to OC what reason was it?
Sorry if I seem dumb, but just not following.
Are they swingers or not?
Bridget Irwin and Ms N Irwin are significant figures. Ms N was less than 28 weeks pregnant,according to flight details. They were booked into the Tapas that night, but the T9denied all knowledge of them when asked by the PJ. T9 may well have been swingers, but my research so far suggests the additional possibility of dodgy property dealing and medical matters; the interlink between the two isn't clear yet.
ReplyDeleteEu penso que se atribui aos McCann e amigos um estatuto que eles não tinham na altura.
ReplyDeleteAs férias low cost, por um período de tempo curto em época baixa significam isso mesmo: não há dinheiro para mais.
Estes casais esfolam-se por subir na vida cara britânica, pagar contas, ter filhos e pagar a casinha rural britânica.
Os saloios e os amigos vêm de férias para a PdL. Escolher um resort inglês não me parece que seja por anonimato mas por conveniência.
Não têm dinheiro para luxar mas gostam de viajar e gostam da companhia uns dos outros por isso vão de férias juntos.
To be or not to be a swinger não acrescenta nada à nossa investigação, apenas pode ser um indício de abandono das crianças no período pós-creche, quando passam a estar à guarda dos pais especialmente se estes tiverem planos para passar algum tempo entregues à luxuria. E isto, apenas se houver boas razões para seguir esta linha de investigação...
Há pais simplesmente negligentes, sem ligação afectiva aos filhos e sem precisarem de distracções para actuarem assim...
As crianças são deitadas mais cedo
para se iniciarem as demarches e é como se elas estivessem no quarto ao lado mesmo que os adultos estejam no apartamento do lado...onde é que já ouvi isto?
Se houver programa no quarto ao lado percebe-se porque não são pedidos os serviços de babysitting...por outro lado parece que a creche estava aberta até tarde mas talvez as crianças fossem demasiado pequenas para ficarem tanto tempo acordadas.
Infelizmente Madeleine tem um sono incerto levanta-se e como está sedada cai e não é socorrida em tempo útil. Quando os pais chegam ao apartamento é tarde demais.
Desconhecendo as leis do país mas adivinhando um futuro pouco promissor após a autópsia da filha e a possibilidade dos gémeos lhes serem retirados, o escândalo, a família, fica decidido que o corpo tem que ser escondido. É uma decisão difícil por uma causa maior.
Desde a hora do chá até à hora do alarme foram momentos de grande agitação e frenetismo. Do brainstorming resultou um plano mais ou menos exequível e quando foram todos jantar Madeleine já não se encontrava no O.C.
O resto para mim ainda é um mistério...que se desvenda devagar....como uma manhã de nevoeiro que acaba numa tarde de sol. É preciso tempo...
Agora é importante perceber quem teve a brilhante ideia de constituir o Fundo, como se organizou um corredor diplomático sem precedentes, como é que os saloios têm contactos com alguns membros importantes em Inglaterra, como se intefere na PJ de cima para baixo, como se afasta GA da investigação, explicar o silêncio criminoso da PJ e dos opinion leaders deste país, a entrega dos dossiers da polícia inglesa aos McCann e a contaminação dos provas no FSS.É importante perceber a importância de "partir as pernas ao Inspector" no tribunal aquando do caso de violência nao muito bem provado em tribunal mas do qual resultou apenas um condenado - GA - e já agora gostava de saber se alguém tem a amabilidade de me ceder uma cópia do processo considerado público, entregue as jornalistas...
Até breve
5-A
Anon 8:36,
ReplyDeleteFrom QI's post nothing can be deduced. They're just plain facts, that, together with others, may, then, prove something, one way or another.
For me, what I take from this post, for which I thank QI, is that the OC was a "prison" to the Tapas. The McCanns blatantly limited themselves to it.
The question that is to be pondered is the why. If you submit yourself to the captivity, then various scenarios make sense, if they were forced to be there, a totally different set is then to be considered.
I have my opinion, as you know, but it's subject to change. Constructive criticism and any new logical and reasonable angles are always welcome.
Good point Textusa. I don't know the situation at 2007, but last year and this year at the summer, Golf was expensive in Algarve. But this was not a reason strong ennough for a golfer to stay away from the nice golf courts in Algarve. Specially in a low season. Golf lovers normally spare some money to spend one day in a nice court. But this group had another agenda and the golf become irrelevant. I think they choose the O.C. exactly because of the nature of the resort, the services, the idea that could be almost empty due to the time of the year( then with luck, the resort will be only for them) and because the majority of the guests were british.
ReplyDeleteIf they are swingers, the O.C. was better then a Villa. In a Villa they will be surrounded by local neighbours ( that was their idea) and the eyes will be on them all the time. In the resort, they fill more free because nobody control who went where. Workers and guests were used with croud circulation of people in the flats. In a Villa they will be more exposed and will be very difficult for them to keep the childs away from their affairs, even with a babysitter. In the O.C. they can put the Kids togheter and have one or two flats available only for them, without involving an extra person.
Sometimes the best way to do a secret is doing it in the middle of everybody.
On top of that, I don't know if was true, but when the case started and the swing story came to the papers, the papers said that the O.C. was known as a resort for swingers. This is why this type of guests went to O.C. Resorts in different countries. They are not visiting the country or enjoying the hotel, they are enjoying what they can do in the resort. That can explain the silence of the other guests. They are all in the swinger boat because the Mccann's ruin their holidays. Swingers or not, the guests don't want to be known because the swing still a fylosophy of life recriminated by the majority of the society.
Excelente post anon das 9:51.
ReplyDeleteO livro 'A culpa dos Mccann' tem algumas respostas para as perguntas pertinentes que faz. Tambem comungo da ideia de uns Mccann que chegam a PDL saloios, pobres e sem poder nenhum e nasce ali, com a morte da filha, o poder, o luxo e o dinheiro. O padrinho dos gemeos, com ligacao ao poder politico nos Uk, foi o primeiro a ser enganado, e o elo que estabeleceu as ligacoes perfeitas que haveriam de chegar ate ao embaixador ingles em Lisboa e atraves deste, ao telemovel de Alipio Ribeiro, sentado a jantar num restaurante de Lisboa, ja noite dentro. Isto numa versao portuguesa, e como o medico de uma Vila do interior que conhece o Presidente da Junta de Freguesia e lhe conta a historia do vigario para lhe pedir ajuda. O Presidente de Junta fala ao Presidente de Camara e a corrente comeca. Com sorte, muita emocao e muitos Media pelo meio, a cunha chega ao Primeiro Ministro que nao pode ficar indiferente a uma tragedia que anda nas bocas de todo o mundo. E assim um saloio transforma-se num VIP mas bem ao estilo 'Novo Rico', vive a fama como um 'Pato Bravo' que nao sabe dar valor ao dinheiro porque nao lhe custou a ganhar. Exagera.
O que nao se entende e a livre circulacao dos dinheiros no Fundo. Numa Inglaterra aparentemente organizada e controladora, ha um Fundo fraudulento que circula livre perante a cegueira conveniente das autoridades. Porque? Porque foram enganados por um grupo de saloios e assumir isso seria um escandalo. Assim vai a hipocrisia de quem foi eleito pela maioria dos cidadaos para zelar pelos interesses das maiorias e nao de grupinhos, e para fazer justica sobre os mais indefesos, as criancas e os idosos.
I go for the swinging scenario.
ReplyDeleteAny political, land, medical whatever dealings take place in dicreet locations, but with minimum luxury.
Also, in these meetings, no need for childcaring... not exactly a spouses programs are they?
The kids stay with spouses while the big boys talk business, isn't it?
Anon @ 8.35
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure I understand your post.
I don't see why the female spouses of the group would be excluded from any business meetings/dealings, they were all working women.
I really don't know if swinging was happening, I have an open mind to the possibility but the more I think about it the more I feel it wasn't. Who knows?
Anon @ 10.40
From my experience a villa could be the perfect place to conduct a swinging holiday. Some of them are surrounded by land well away from neighbours. The group had rented a villa on a previous holiday, I think that was where the Gaspars' statements originated.
I don't intend to pursue this line of thinking as I don't know how, when or why this was introduced. I'll leave that to others who may have more background information.
GM's comment on the bus going to the resort about 'not there to enjoy himself' leads me to think it was not a holiday.
QI
QI
ReplyDeleteI'm Anon 8:35. Loved your post.
I should have written "big boys", for I intended to use in a sexless way, for as we know, there are many ladies with "balls" that some guys would love to have. Get the point, but meant both sexes.
Rhe same reason I used the word spouses, and not wives.
Anon @ 8.35
ReplyDeleteThanks for your response. I get what you are saying.
QI
Why Brian Kennedy got involved?
ReplyDelete- A medical scenario- No way.
- A swing scenario- Could be. If this was the case, a deep investigation of the pass in Uk could bring to light the dark innuendos of some VIP people not connected with crime in PDl but connected with their 'Style of life' in UK. If police prove that the swing was the reason to sedate childs and neglect them to the point that one died, the investigation will end in all the swingers connected with them been investigated in UK. I don't get other reason for Brian Kennedy to be involved in that case. Unless he was the Biological father of Madeleine. But that was dismissed. PJ had that suspiction at the beginning but Gerry is the Biological father. Then the life style of the group could be the connection.
Like Casa Pia which started with Bibi but a deep investigation bring to light the VIPs.
quote
ReplyDeleteI don't know why this case is so important to me, maybe it's because I hate injustice and have experienced the British legal system, which stinks at times."
unquote
Tell me about it!!!
TC
Medical people- Dr Julian Totman, Dr Louise Hume, Dr Patel,Paul Weinberger-BIVDA, NICE, Jane Tanner, Fisher Scientific Leicester, which may have links with BIVDA. Jane involved in a conference for FS in Vilamoura in a previous year. Paul Weinberger at a BIVDA Conference in Belfast the week after the holiday? and flew there from Belfast with Jeni Weinberger,she of the fat gypsy sighting. Friends of the Totman's. Both couples from Wiltshire. Jayne Jensen- business in Marlborough, Wilts, Curtis Brain, partner of Dr Louise, works for estate agents...so it goes on. Textusa- please feel free to edit this if you feel it wouldn't be helpful to say this much at this stage.
ReplyDeleteAnon 2:14
ReplyDeleteIf memory serves me right, the "last call" was made more than a month ago.
Who established without a doubt that Gerry IS Madeleine's bio father?...the FSS?...has any portuguese or other independent and reliable lab done DNA testing on that? Don't think so...are we to take the FSS's or the McCanns word on that matter?...Where is inequivocal proof that Gerry is "100%" Maddie's father? Where is the lab report that states it?...maybe in the same place as the report from the Social Services that confirms that the McCanns behavior towards their children while on PDl "was totally within the bounds of responsible parenting", which is...nowhere, only in the McCanns (and of those who helped them) imaginative fabrications.
ReplyDeleteOh, but I see..., Gerry said so, Mitchell said so, and what they say is gospell, so... DO NOT DARE TO DOUBT IT (or else...)!!!
All ok then!
Amaral said on his book that Madeleine ADN has a combination of Kate and Gerry, like what was supposed to be if he was her Bio father. The result came from a UK report (FSS maybe), but I believe some tests have been done also in Portugal and they arrived to the same conclusion. The best forensic lab with best cientists in Portugal were involved in the investigation since day one. Gerry being or not Madeleine bio father was part of the first steps in the investigation. Then I believe, PJ has no doubts about that. Later on his book, Amaral said that the ADN from the twins was different then Madeleine ADN. Then the excuse gave by the Mccann's and Mitchell to explain what the dogs find in the car, was utter rubbish. Contamination due to the twins nappies or anything related with twins, was impossible. Another desperate lie to dismiss the work of the expensive and reliable dogs.
ReplyDeleteAT:AT:
ReplyDeleteSep 23, 2010 9:19:00 PM - ANNON who said:
"Bridget Irwin and Ms N Irwin are significant figures. Ms N was less than 28 weeks pregnant,according to flight details. They were booked into the Tapas that night, but the T9denied all knowledge of them when asked by the PJ. T9 may well have been swingers, but my research so far suggests the additional possibility of dodgy property dealing and medical matters; the interlink between the two isn't clear yet".
Thank you for that. My research indicates there is a similar dodgy property/money connection here:
Brigid ODonnell - partner to Jez Wilkins - and Mccarrick. This deal is via an estate agency business jointly owned by the two families. It is based at Lagos and opened for business 2 days after ODonnell and Wilkins left PDL in 2007. There was alot of 'land grab' mentality in and around Portimao at the time as the new F1 track and extensive complex was just coming on stream.
Gerry's paternity was proved by both Portuguese and British labs.
ReplyDelete